List of feature

Author: Comraden
Remark: This Extension is will finished soon.
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List of feature

Postby comraden » Wed Apr 18, 2012 2:12 am

as a comparision to 1.6
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Re: List of feature

Postby DFCDay » Wed Apr 18, 2012 6:54 am

Where can I download the Extension?

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Re: List of feature

Postby comraden » Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:19 am

From my local disk?
Means it is not downloadable. (couse it is not ready yet).
And U didn't pay (unknown amount) for it.
:whistling:
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Re: List of feature

Postby marco_ve » Fri May 04, 2012 11:33 am

comraden wrote:From my local disk?
Means it is not downloadable. (couse it is not ready yet).
And U didn't pay (unknown amount) for it.
:whistling:


When will this extension available?
Bye,
Marco.

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===================================================

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Re: List of feature

Postby comraden » Fri May 04, 2012 3:44 pm

marco_ve wrote:When will this extension available?

I don't know. I have no motivation.
It's almost done, at least one week for finish.
U wanna be the first one treerank user? The price is ... 300EUR :whistling:
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Re: List of feature

Postby marco_ve » Fri May 04, 2012 3:59 pm

I am sorry, I have no budget for this price.
We are no-profit volleyball team! :-)
Thanks anyway!
Bye,
Marco.

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Re: List of feature

Postby teddy » Mon May 07, 2012 6:30 pm

Hi comraden, I am saying you this beacause I think your move could be dangerous for Joomleague and all the devs following you in selling their products
You have obviously all the rights to evaluate (and you are the only one, as well) your work and decide for the price that meets the difficult compromise between demand and offer. For sure you know better than me what you are doing.
But the price you told us carries an actual risk, a risk often overlooked by developers when dealing with their products, the one of being unfit for the enviroment you live in. I've dealt with a few developers, and believe me if I tell you that devs thinking about their work in the order of 10s or 100s of sells (with affordable prices) are still on their respective, niche, markets. Devs trying to get an immediate return on (time) investment by selling 3, 4, 5 copies of their product are nowhere to be seen any more.
My limited experience anyway, take it for what it's worth.
Regarding your product, please don't take it as offense but a suggestion, remember you are selling to volunteers who often don't get paid for what they do, and your product is an extension for a free product.
Comparing it with other payed Joomla sport extensions, actually there is no comparison regarding price, yours is 4 times more than the highest one. Maybe your work has a lot of unreachable features, but you have to persuade clients to pay for this. Keep in mind that extensions like
-Jomsocial (ok, other economies of scale, but far more complexity) sell for 80€,
-Community builder subscription for 65€ with all its extensions (and that's a similarity with your product), and each of them goes without subscription from 15 to 25€,
- Sobipro for 30€, with additional extensions for 60€
- akeeba products go from 20€ to 40€
- Nonumber extensions go form 10 to 50€ (and all of them, more than 20, for 195€)
and many others you can check by yourself. They are very popular, but they started far less popular like you are now, and didn't sell at your prices.
I deeply appreciate your work for JL and I hope you got my line of thought, remember you've always got customization work.
If you don't, at least I hope someone else will act differently.

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Re: List of feature

Postby timoline » Mon May 07, 2012 8:14 pm

:whistling: :cool:
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Re: List of feature

Postby comraden » Wed May 09, 2012 2:51 am

Target for treerank are NOT volunteers/non-profit admins ("no budget for this price", "too much for me", "my league is non-profit", ... ).
They could pay only 20EUR, and this will be still too much for them.

My idea is create PRO version of joomleague, that we(devs) could sell for more than 500EUR (maybe much more with support).
And not NOW.
I don't trying to get "here and now cash".
Lets develop new jl_2.5. And develop PRO in middle of 2013.

After your post I put "sport software" to google.
I find http://www.dataproject.com/VolleyBall/Service.aspx
At SOLUTION I find:
Team ranking BY PHASE.
news:
"Wien, 17th September 2011
During the 32nd General Assembly of the CEV, Emilio Spirito, CEO of Data Project, presented the new CEV website entirely developed by the Data Project team. Those who attended got a sneak preview of the website, which is the result of several months hard work that led to achieving the new website, with restyled structure and contents, catchy graphics and a user friendly navigation system. Andrè Meyer, president of the CEV, was extremely pleased with the result and is looking forward to future collaborations with Data Project. Jizhong Wei, president of the FIVB also congratulated Data Project for the work done. If you want to know what we are talking about visit http://www.cev.lu/default.aspx. You won’t be dissapointed!"

I thought that they find my solution!. Only several months hard work done by 8 developers of DataProject!
ok, lets see at cev.lu
and what? big shiiiiiit.....
yeah, they made phase ranking & final standing (the first I ever saw), but it looks ... like nothing.
- final standing inputted by hand, no data, pure teams-name
- no tree bracket available
- what does it mean "qualified" & "eliminated", I wanna know who played with in playoffs
- (...)
I'm really dissapointed.

And CEV organize ~50 competitions by year (25 man + 25 woman).
So DataProject give them 50 times shit. (multiple this by years, ehhhhhh, tons of shit for UNKNOWN AMOUNT OF $)
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Re: List of feature

Postby teddy » Wed May 09, 2012 11:06 am

Comraden, I agree with you, they didn't care too much about overall information architecture, but if you go on the menu above and select for instance champions league, you get
http://www.cev.lu/Competition-Area/Comp ... pe=LegList
and this for match details
http://www.cev.lu/Competition-Area/Matc ... pe=LegList
Not too bad, but of course for the whole website CEV should have payed loads of money...
Anyway datavolley is a world reknown standalone data and statistics analysis suite. It is far more complex than JL regarding input and filtering possibilities, its interface allows any type of analysis and interaction and can produce customized (granular and VERY customized) presentation. All in real time, for several platforms.
I've been working with dataproject for volley in 2003, as a (volunteer) scoutman in italian A2, and I know their devs have been working on it for more than 25 years now.
They offer great premium telephone support (or used to), and packages go from 99 to 199€ annually.
It's a completely different product, and I don't know what you want to achieve, but I'm excited if you can reach their heights in 1-2 years.
Far less if your marketing analysis leads you to prices you just anticipated.

By the way, doing the same google research, I've seen JL competitor on 4th place:
http://www.joomsport.com
It seems a good product, look at its tree option:
http://demo.joomsport.com/index.php/dub ... mpionships
Maybe it's got far less features but a pro annual license costs little more than 50€...

Don't want to hurt your motivation though, please keep up the good work, you are doing great!

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Re: List of feature

Postby comraden » Thu May 10, 2012 9:31 am

teddy wrote:But the price you told us carries an actual risk, a risk often overlooked by developers when dealing with their products, the one of being unfit for the enviroment you live in. I've dealt with a few developers, and believe me if I tell you that devs thinking about their work in the order of 10s or 100s of sells (with affordable prices) are still on their respective, niche, markets. Devs trying to get an immediate return on (time) investment by selling 3, 4, 5 copies of their product are nowhere to be seen any more.

I can only say:
Treerank will NOT be sold for 20EUR.
Actual price is set to 300EUR.

Treerank will be always for free to joommleague developers.
:whistling:
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Re: List of feature

Postby And_One » Thu May 10, 2012 9:46 am

a good, nice looking and flexible tournament software is always worth its price

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Re: List of feature

Postby Tenarro » Sat May 12, 2012 12:27 am

omg - this is the point where I will leave JL. The planed basic component doesnt do what i need and when only this extension will cost 300€ i dont want to know what you want for JL pro ... lool ... your users are 99%-100% from amateur teams and ... sry no amateur team will buy it, no amateur team can buy it. And all pro teams have there own website developers.

Wake up and come back to real life!

No way, im out and i can tell you what you will get -> a Game Over ... not more and not less


Greetings and good luck in selling this overpriced stuff - I will stay by JoomSport. They have a fair price for pro version and a very friendly support.
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Re: List of feature

Postby timoline » Sat May 12, 2012 6:06 am

relax.....this is just a discussion....nothing more nothing less :confused:
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Re: List of feature

Postby tranceRoller » Sat May 12, 2012 9:28 am

Hello, everybody!
comradens extensions looks really good.
Can admins create voting poll here to ask users hom much they are ready to spend for this one?
www.ogres-turnirs.lv -> JoomLeague 1.5.2

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Re: List of feature

Postby And_One » Sat May 12, 2012 3:24 pm

Tenarro wrote:omg - this is the point where I will leave JL. The planed basic component doesnt do what i need and when only this extension will cost 300€ i dont want to know what you want for JL pro ... lool ... your users are 99%-100% from amateur teams and ... sry no amateur team will buy it, no amateur team can buy it. And all pro teams have there own website developers.

Wake up and come back to real life!

No way, im out and i can tell you what you will get -> a Game Over ... not more and not less


Greetings and good luck in selling this overpriced stuff - I will stay by JoomSport. They have a fair price for pro version and a very friendly support.


ok good luck with JoomSport Pro, it costs what it costs and JoomLeague is and was ever available without any costs. just feel free to donate something ;)

every extension developer can do whatever he wants with his extension. it has nothing to do with the core component. so why do you complain about it. if you are happy with the core, which is free anyways, good and if not stay with any other component. good luck!

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Re: List of feature

Postby comraden » Sat May 12, 2012 10:39 pm

It is all my fault. I show a candy, I gave lick and ... violently took away.
Depply sorry @tenarro. I really didn't want. :oops:
I removed Your tournament from treerank demo site (so that will not hurt Your eyes anymore).

From the other hand ... What did U expect from the most annoying person on the forum?
;)
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Re: List of feature

Postby comraden » Sun May 13, 2012 1:25 am

Features comparision (according to RANKING only).
If U want another software, give me link here, I'll add it to the list ...
http://treerank.llk.pl/index.php?option ... &Itemid=24
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Re: List of feature

Postby diddipoeler » Sat Jun 23, 2012 7:40 pm

comraden wrote:I can only say:
Treerank will NOT be sold for 20EUR.
Actual price is set to 300EUR.
Treerank will be always for free to joommleague developers.
:whistling:

wie 300 eur ? geld für ne extension verlangen :gelb:
das teil kann man eh nicht für fussball benutzen, also was solls !
und wo kann das ein developer downloaden ?
über 8 Mio. Spielpaarungen auf http://www.laola-fussball-international.de/
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Re: List of feature

Postby comraden » Sat Jun 23, 2012 10:35 pm

diddipoeler wrote:wie 300 eur ? geld für ne extension verlangen :gelb:
das teil kann man eh nicht für fussball benutzen, also was solls !
und wo kann das ein developer downloaden ?

translated with google, .... und Ich nicht verstehe :confused:

JL developers could download this extension on bettercodes.org.
Create account, search project TreeRank, send messages/invites to me (administrator:comraden).
Then I'll add U to developers.
By the way: U are NOT administrator on gitorious.org/joomleague, but for U I'll make a exception ;) .
Attention: still under development, many features doesn't work (I think only me could work with present version, ask @timoline :confused: , he tryed )
Of course I could help with test project (if U want).

and please write in english :bash:
What about sth like "it doesn't work with football" ??? [das teil kann man eh nicht für fussball benutzen] ???
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Re: List of feature

Postby comraden » Sun Jun 24, 2012 7:36 pm

access granted :)
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Re: List of feature

Postby diddipoeler » Wed Jun 27, 2012 12:19 pm

wie funzt das eigentlich mit dem treerank ?

kann man es nur nutzen, wenn die paarungen der runden feststehen ?
also man weiss ganz genau welcher sieger gegen welchen sieger !

im dfb-pokal werden ja die neuen runden immer ausgelost. funzt das auch ?
über 8 Mio. Spielpaarungen auf http://www.laola-fussball-international.de/
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Re: List of feature

Postby comraden » Wed Jun 27, 2012 2:48 pm

diddipoeler wrote:kann man es nur nutzen, wenn die paarungen der runden feststehen ?

U could use treerank for EVERY POSSIBLE TOURNAMENTS with many stages(phases).
(translated with google :bash: )

Other phrases are incomprehensible for me :confused:

edit:
Give me the most complicated tournament (as .jlg file), I'll show U possibilities on treerank demo site ...
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Re: List of feature

Postby And_One » Wed Jun 27, 2012 3:09 pm

diddipoeler wrote:wie funzt das eigentlich mit dem treerank ?

kann man es nur nutzen, wenn die paarungen der runden feststehen ?
also man weiss ganz genau welcher sieger gegen welchen sieger !

im dfb-pokal werden ja die neuen runden immer ausgelost. funzt das auch ?


- nein, da ein turnierbaum (mit oder ohne vorrunde/qualifikation) sowieso die anzahl der matches vorgibt
- ja, das turniersystem weis das aufgrund der ergebnisse
- ja, weil du die matches mit eindeutigen ids sowieso hast und du nur die richtige paarung zusammenstellen musst aufgrund der losung.

generell gilt zu sagen, dass ein turnierbaumsystem immer nur die matches zu erzeugen hat. man kann, wenn man das seeding berücksicht, den baum automatisch erzeugen lassen und bei normalen gewinner vorrückungen ist es klar auszurechnen wer an welche position kommt im baum. schwieriger wird es wenn zufällig pro runde dann die matches verschoben werden. im endeffekt auch kein problem da ja eigentlich nicht das match verschoben wird sondern nur wer gegen wen. comraden sein system kann alles abdecken mit ein wenig handarbeit im system selbst.
was für turniere sicher am wichtigsten ist, sind die rankings. entweder ein globales oder halt pro division und baum. da wird es dann genial, denn das neue treerank kann beides. single rankings und kombinierte.

aslo das was jetzt viele system nur sehr umständlich und mit viel handarbeit zusammenbringen ist hier in einem einzigen system mit joomleague abgebildet.

aja das system ist sozusagen von der sportart unabhängig das es nur den modus selber abbildet. im prinzip muss man im match hinterlegen wer gewonnen hat und wie, sodass das man mit den zahlen rechnen kann.

ich selber habe es mit mehreren sportarten getestet und konnte bis auf ein paar wenige unstimmigkeiten sehr gut damit arbeiten. die frage nach dem preis erübrigt sich, wenn man mal als turnierorga ohne system ( oder mit anderen die nicht annhähernd das können ) gearbeitet hat. wer es schafft zb. 256 teams im quadruple mit vorrunden und anschliessenden double elimitination mit random rounds ohne system zu verwalten und dabei weniger als 4-5std aufwand hat bekommt einen preis von mir ;)

deswegen: daumen hoch comraden (my personal tourney master) :D :D

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Re: List of feature

Postby comraden » Wed Jun 27, 2012 5:38 pm

:cool:
(as I understood damn google translate, he he he)
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Re: List of feature

Postby diddipoeler » Thu Jun 28, 2012 7:55 am

And_One wrote:deswegen: daumen hoch comraden (my personal tourney master) :D :D

und was hälst du hier von: http://**************.grammatikas-gri ... ee&p=33278 ?
über 8 Mio. Spielpaarungen auf http://www.laola-fussball-international.de/
über 8 Mio. Spielpaarungen auf http://www.**************.de/
Joomlaversion: 1.5.26
Testserver mit Joomleague Version 0.93
Tippspieltestseite: http://joomleague16.**************/
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Re: List of feature

Postby svdoldie » Thu Jun 28, 2012 8:01 am

diddipoeler wrote:und was hälst du hier von: http://**************.grammatikas-gri ... ee&p=33278 ?


wow, optisch sieht das schon mal klasse aus.
kann man das auch testen ? ;)

gruß svdoldie
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Re: List of feature

Postby And_One » Thu Jun 28, 2012 8:46 am

diddipoeler wrote:
And_One wrote:deswegen: daumen hoch comraden (my personal tourney master) :D :D

und was hälst du hier von: http://**************.grammatikas-gri ... ee&p=33278 ?


Nettes Layout, aber 4:2 als Endergebnis einzutragen ist aber nicht der Weisheit letzter Schluß oder ;)

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Re: List of feature

Postby comraden » Thu Jun 28, 2012 9:45 am

diddipoeler wrote:und was hälst du hier von: http://**************.grammatikas-gri ... ee&p=33278 ?

only one question:
Is there ranking from this tree? :p
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Re: List of feature

Postby diddipoeler » Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:15 am

comraden wrote:
diddipoeler wrote:und was hälst du hier von: http://**************.grammatikas-gri ... ee&p=33278 ?

only one question:
Is there ranking from this tree? :p

um gottes willen !
das habe ich mit jquery gemacht !
über 8 Mio. Spielpaarungen auf http://www.laola-fussball-international.de/
über 8 Mio. Spielpaarungen auf http://www.**************.de/
Joomlaversion: 1.5.26
Testserver mit Joomleague Version 0.93
Tippspieltestseite: http://joomleague16.**************/
Das Komplettpaket: https://github.com/diddipoeler/joomleague-komplett
Das Komplettpaket 2.0: https://github.com/diddipoeler/joomleague-2-komplettpaket


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